Ukrainan konflikti/sota
Antares
Respected Leader
GRU kärsinyt.
Venäjän eliittijoukon shokkitappiot - "kaikki heitettiin lihamyllyyn" | Verkkouutiset
GRU:n erikoisjoukkojen kerrotaan käyneen kovia taisteluita viime viikolla Itä-Ukrainassa.www.verkkouutiset.fi
Tuo on niin herkullinen löytö että pitääpä ihan kelata alkuperäislähteeseen asti, lainaan siitä tekstin tähän alle: LINKKI
"Thrown in a meat grinder."The elite brigade of the GRU suffered serious losses during the retreat from Liman
- Ilya Barabanov, Olga Ivshina
- BBC
The BBC has learned that elite Russian military formations took part in the unsuccessful defense of Liman, and they suffered serious losses.The 3rd Guards Special Forces Brigade of the Main Directorate of the General Staff lost at least nine people dead and one seriously wounded during the retreat from Liman, the BBC found out by studying social networks and talking with the sister of one of the dead soldiers. Such military formations have been sent to the most important military missions since Soviet times. While the Russian army was retreating from this city in the Donetsk region, Russian propaganda told that it was defended by mobilized from the self-proclaimed LPR and Russian volunteers from the Bars units, which are formed in the regions.
"The entire third special brigade was killed by the special forces. They threw it into a meat grinder. What a handsome man I have. 19 years old."
"When performing tasks on the territory of Ukraine, my brother died heroically. Eternal memory to you, my heart, my hero!"
"They told me very sad news for me! My brothers, friends, true comrades in the service and just good men died. I will miss you!"
"We ask for prayers for the repose of the warrior Vyacheslav (Zintsov), a graduate of the boarding school at the Nikolo-Shartomsky Monastery. He died in Krasny Liman."
On September 30 and October 1, a number of messages appeared on the VKontakte social network, which indicated that the retreat of the Russian army from the city of Liman in the Donetsk region was not as easy as the official Russian media reported, and not only volunteers tried to defend the city from Russia or mobilized residents of the self-proclaimed republics that Vladimir Putin had declared by that time to be Russian territory.
"8 people died, two were injured in serious condition. One of them died, one is still alive, but very heavy. The whole group almost died. The guys are real heroes. It's a pity that there are no more of these heroes," the BBC said. si sister of one of the dead servicemen, confirming that during the retreat from Liman, the detachment was lost by the 3rd special forces brigade of the General Staff from Tolyatti. "A total of nine people died, two were injured," said the wife of another victim.
Their relatives do not have full information about the place and circumstances of the death of the paratroopers, the information they receive is fragmentary: “I know that these guys were abandoned there, they fought back for a whole day, but could not. My brother died, he was only 21 years old, he died friend, he is 19 years old,” said the sister of the deceased. When the bodies of the servicemen will be returned home and when the funeral will take place, the families do not yet know.
19-year-old private Danil Boikov was the youngest in this department; senior lieutenant Vyacheslav Zintsov, junior lieutenant Viktor Gorobets, foremen Andrey Shorin and Yuri Filatov, and private Aleksey Chindin were killed with him. Servicemen Karpenko and Uzbyakov were taken to the hospital with severe wounds. Uzbyakov later died.
This is probably the largest one-time loss of the 3rd Special Purpose Brigade, although it suffered losses from the very beginning of the war: “Of course, [losses] were, but does anyone tell us about this,” said the sister of one of the victims.
As far as we know from open sources, the first fighters of the 3rd GRU brigade died in early March. Before the retreat from Liman, the most difficult day for the brigade was the day from March 3 to March 4 - then four scouts were killed: company commander Major Azamat Alimov, captain Alexei Chuchmanov, junior sergeant Stanislav Gerasimov and junior sergeant Yegor Bukatin.
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After reviewing the photos on the stand, the BBC found out that the names of most of the commandos mentioned had previously appeared in the media and social networks, but without specifying the place of service. The stand also featured photographs of two Grushnikovs whose deaths had not been publicly reported before. Now at least nine new names have been added to this list.
And then, and now, almost every fourth soldier of the GRU special forces who died is an officer. Such losses are especially sensitive for the army and difficult to replace. A special forces officer can only be replaced by a person with the same specialty and level of training, and this takes years of training and training.
According to Michael Kofman, an expert at the American Center for Naval Analysis, for every Russian soldier who died during the war in Ukraine, an average of about three and a half were wounded. On the basis of these data, it can be assumed that more than 200 people could have left the ranks of the 3rd GRU special forces brigade as a result of death or injury (at least temporarily).
The exact number of special forces units is classified. But even according to conservative estimates, the elimination of more than 200 fighters can be equivalent to the complete failure of two special forces companies. During the war in Chechnya, the reconnaissance companies of the GRU spetsnaz consisted of 45-70 people. If we take such an assessment as a basis, it is possible that 75% of the reconnaissance companies of the brigade were put out of action.
What is the 3rd brigade of the Main Directorate of General Staff
The 3rd GRU brigade, now commanded by Colonel Albert Omarov, was created in 1966 in the GDR. From January 1991 to June 1992, she was deployed in Riga, and then was relocated to the village of Roshchinsky, Samara Region. In 2010, the brigade moved to Tolyatti. The brigade's servicemen took part in the civil war in Tajikistan, two Chechen campaigns, a peacekeeping mission in Kosovo, and in the early 2000s they guarded Russian missions in Kabul, Afghanistan. In August 2017, the brigade lost two of its members in Syria.
The year 2015 turned out to be scandalous for the 3rd GRU brigade, when two Russian citizens Yevgeny Erofeev and Alexander Alexandrov were captured near the town of Shchastya in the Luhansk region. During interrogation, they stated that they were servicemen of the 3rd Guards Brigade. The Russian side, which at that time denied the presence of its troops in eastern Ukraine, said that these servicemen had long since retired and fought on the side of the "LPR people's militia" as volunteers.
In April 2016, Erofeev and Aleksandrov were sentenced in Ukraine to 14 years in prison, and a month later they were exchanged for the Ukrainian pilot Nadezhda Savchenko, whom the Russian side accused of being involved in the death of the film crew of the All-Russian State Television and Radio Broadcasting Company. Nothing was reported about the further fate of Erofeev and Aleksandrov, and Savchenko then managed to visit the deputy of the Verkhovna Rada, a defendant in a criminal case and a journalist.
Between the Cossacks and the mobilized
The Russian media almost never report on operations involving the special forces of the General Staff, sometimes this becomes known after the fact if the operation is successful, and in the case of the war in Ukraine and if we are talking about retreats of the Russian army, propaganda always tries to present the case in such a way that on a specific sector of the front, it was not regular military men who failed, but Russian volunteers and those mobilized from the self-proclaimed republics.
This is how it happened when the Armed Forces of Ukraine broke through the front in the Kharkiv region, eventually freeing Balakleya, Izyum, Kupyansk and many other settlements. Then the Russian media said that the front line was held there by mobilized from the LNR and fighters of the Russian Guard from Bashkortostan and Samara. Only a few days later it turned out that marines from the Kaliningrad region were captured there.
Kuvan tekstien Google Lens -käännös, kiitos käyttäjälle "Sanavalmis Muurinen":
Official Russian military correspondents spoke about the defenders of Liman in similar intonations: “It is immediately clear from them that these are ordinary war workers, on whom the fronts have been held up throughout our history. No show-offs, excesses in equipment, bravado,” wrote Alexander Kots from Komsomolskaya Pravda, specifying that these are volunteers from the Bars-13 detachment, Cossacks, mobilized residents of the self-proclaimed LPR and the 20th Army.
The telegram channel Rybar, which specializes in military subjects, specified the composition of Liman’s defenders: “503rd Guards Motorized Rifle Regiment from the 19th Motorized Rifle Division of the 58th Combined Arms Army.” In the pro-Russian channel "Older Edda" they wrote: "The Liman is defended not only by the Kuban BARS, but also by the regular army."
And the former journalist of the Russian pro-Kremlin channel Lifenews and the author of the Wargonzo project, Semyon Pegov, told those gathered on Red Square in honor of the annexation of the occupied territories of Ukraine that Liman was defended by "Smolensk infantry, Barsy" - volunteers, "Russian Legion", commandants who do not leave the city" .
From the obituaries that have appeared in recent days and conversations with relatives of the victims, it became clear that, in addition to those mobilized from the self-proclaimed republics and volunteers, the GRU special forces also tried (unsuccessfully) to hold Liman.
In the USSR, the GRU special forces were used to carry out the most important secret operations and sabotage behind enemy lines.
In Russia, GRU detachments began to be entrusted with other - unusual for them - tasks, since many other army units were not prepared to participate in battles. In the early years of the war in Chechnya, the GRU special forces were often used simply as combined arms intelligence. And during the assault on Grozny, special forces detachments were generally included in the assault groups on a common basis.
Experts interviewed by the BBC note that during the war on the territory of Ukraine, GRU detachments are again used to solve tasks unusual for elite intelligence officers (including defensive battles), and this leads to additional losses.
We continue to collect data on the dead military personnel. If you would like to share information on this topic, please contact us at the link .
Seuraava lainaus on "välikäden" eli The Moscow Timesin artikkeli, jossa viitataan tuohon alkuperäiseen. Otan tämänkin varalta talteen: LÄHDE
Elite Russian Intelligence Unit Suffers Major Losses in Ukraine – BBC
Oct. 5, 2022
A Ukrainian serviceman walks along road while searching for dead bodies of his comrades in recently recaptured town of Lyman, Ukraine. Evgeniy Maloletka / AP / ТАСС
An elite, highly secretive Russian military intelligence unit may have lost up to three-quarters of its reconnaissance manpower in Ukraine, according to research published by the BBC’s Russian service Tuesday.
Like other special forces units, the exact size of the GRU intelligence agency’s 3rd Guards Spetsnaz Brigade is classified.
But based on the brigade’s death toll and likely attrition rate tallied by BBC Russia, the outlet concluded that it may have lost 75% of its reconnaissance company troops.
Overall, the outlet said it has found direct and indirect evidence from publicly available sources on 56 soldiers from the 3rd Guards Spetsnaz Brigade killed in the seven months since Russia invaded Ukraine.
One dead soldier’s sister told BBC Russia she believes there may have been more losses, saying: “Do you expect they’ll tell us about them?”
Russia Lost 900 ‘Elite’ Soldiers in Ukraine Fighting — Report
Read more
The GRU’s 3rd Guards Spetsnaz Brigade appears to have suffered its highest losses so far in the latest retreat from eastern Ukraine’s key railway hub of Lyman last week.
Citing the soldiers’ relatives, BBC Russia reported that up to nine brigade members died while attempting to defend against the Ukrainian forces’ counteroffensive in Lyman.
“The entire 3rd Spetsnaz Brigade was laid to waste, thrown into the meat grinder,” one soldier’s unnamed relative was quoted as saying in a post on the Russian social media platform VKontakte.
The unit’s previous highest death toll in a single battle known publicly was in the early days of Russia’s invasion in March, when BBC Russia said four brigade soldiers had been killed.
One out of four 3rd Guards Spetsnaz Brigade soldiers killed under the command of Col. Albert Omarov were officers, the outlet said.
The deaths of such soldiers are particularly problematic for the Russian Armed Forces because they are very costly to replace.
Russian state media and pro-Moscow military bloggers avoid reporting on the GRU units’ involvement in Ukraine, BBC Russia said, meaning information on reconnaissance soldiers’ deaths appears after the fact. Experts cited by the outlet say the special forces suffer additional losses because they are forced to carry out tasks outside their remit.
Russia claims to have lost fewer than 6,000 troops in the seven-month conflict with Ukraine, 20 times less than what it claims the Ukrainian military has lost.
BBC Russia’s joint tally with the independent Mediazona news website placed Russia’s death toll at nearly 6,800 soldiers by Sept. 25.
Read more about: GRU , Ukraine war
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Sanavalmis Muurinen
Kenraali
Sotakoira
Kapteeni
Golgatan Olgalle kertynyt runsaasti "asiaa". On kyllä häijy ämmä.
Antares
Respected Leader
Kas, päivä tai pari sitten oli venäläisen sotilaan haastattelu Svatovesta ja hänen komentaja oli sanonut että kohta isketään tykistöllä ja sitten vastahyökätään. Liekö samasta kyse vai olisivatko eri joukot, en ole varma paljonko heillä on sotilaita Svatoven pohjoispuolella (olen olettanut että ainakin rautatien varren kaupungeissa / kylissä voisi olla esim. Troitskessa ihan rajan tuntumassa).
en oo asiantuntija, mutta sanoisin liian pehmeä maa tuohon toimintaan?Mitä sanoo RSKRH ukot tähän
RaahenArhippa
Alikersantti
Tässä on käynyt Dimmulla typo, tuskin kuitenkaan Luka
Oman rajallisen venäjän taitoni mukaan "Kto vmesto Putina" kääntyisi enneminkin että Kuka Putinin tilalle.Onneksi vetonaru oli riittävän pitkä...Mitä sanoo RSKRH ukot tähän
Leaderwolf
Respected Leader
Sanatarkasti jos Twiitin lukee niin joo, ehdottomasti, luka Putinin tilalle. Alkaisi ne perunat nousemaan maasta! Luka! Luka! Luka!
Putinxyjlo
Eversti
Joo, kranu selän taa, nosti pyssyn penkalle ja etupenkassa pöläys, toinen kypärässä. Ei nyt varsin mikään "shelling" kyseessä.
On siinä ryssällä kohtalo, nähdä vilua ja nälkää tulomatkalla pöllityn pesukoneen vieressä maakuopassa. Saat tiedon, että suurruhtinas tsaari on mogilisoinut poikasi sotaan ja odotat touhutippa housussa pääsyä esittelemään pesukonetta babuskalle Irkutskissa. Olet miettinyt jo miten saat koneelle vedet lähipurosta ja hekumoit puhtaista kalsareista. Sitten kuuluukin rapina, tarkistat pesukoneesi, Ivan ei vieläkään sitä vienyt vaikka kännissä uhkasi. Pian kajahtaa takanasi kranaatti, nostat Ho Chi Minhissä taistelleen kiväärisi ja kohotat päässäsi olevaa alumiinikypärää. Näet väläyksen ja alat tuijottaa pesukoneen luukkuun, kuulematta tai näkemättä mitään. Blyat, kannatti tulla.
Onko tuliasema ylärinteessä, ja vastimen takareuna on vähän kuin tyhjän päällä?
Antares
Respected Leader
Rybarin Khersonia käsittelevässä kartassa oli eilen juttua siitä, miten Ukraina olisi siirtänyt Mykolaivin kaupunkia suojanneita joukkoja selustaan.
Mietin sitä silloin, olisiko kyse rotaatiosta, joukkojen lepuuttamisesta vai siirretäänkö sotilaat kalustoineen selustaan, jotta ne voidaan kuljettaa junilla muualle. Toki jos kyse on tuoreesta huhusta, niin suuri määrä joukkoja ja kalustoa ei siirry yhdessä päivässä tai kahdessakaan.
Mihin tuollainen joukko voisi siirtyä? He ovat hyökänneet rintaman molemmissa äärilaidoissa, joten oma arvaus on että kolmas hyökkäys voisi tapahtua näiden kahden puolivälissä, Zaporitzzjan alueella. Kohti Melitopolia vai sen ohi ja aina Krimin suulle asti? Jos voimat riittävät.
Jos ampuvat omien yli, niin aika ikävä yllätys voi olla mahdollinenMitä sanoo RSKRH ukot tähän
Antares
Respected Leader
Tuo tarkoittaisi että molemmat selvät vetäytymistiet on suljettu!
Oletin että ryssä vetäytyisi tuolta kohti Khersonia, mutta jos valtatie P-81 on Ukrainan hallinnassa niin vetäytyminen ei onnistukaan. Tai toki voi taistella tiensä sulkurenkaan läpi, mutta on myös kokoajan tykistön vaikutuksen alla joten siitä vain kokeilemaan.
oisaalta Snihurivka on myös tykistön ja heittimien tulen alla, joten pelkkiä huonoja vaihtoehtoja ryssällä.
Ja sitten asiaa Amerikasta. Juttelin eilen amerikkalaisen serkkutytön kanssa Ukrainan tilanteesta. Hän oli huolissaan Putinin ydinaseaikeista. Väitin hänelle, että ydinaseen käyttäminen Ukrainassa merkitsisi NATO:n sekaantumista tapahtumiin voimakkaammin ja Putinille varmaa häviötä sodassa, ja hän ei halua varmasti hävitä. En ole varma, uskoiko.
Sitten keskusteltiin Amerikan ja amerikkalaisten tuesta Ukrainalle. Siinä on mielestäni yllättävää, että hänen mukaansa tuki Ukrainan tukemiselle kattaa laajasti molempien puolueiden poliitikot ja kannattajat äärirepublikaanisia teekutsuliikkeen edustajia lukuunottamatta. Tässäkin asiassa tennesseeläinen senaattori Marsha Blackburn osoittaa kyllä melkoista logiikka: kannattaa kyllä Ukrainan tukemista rukoilemalla, muttei aseapua.
Johtuukohan Jenkkilän kohtuuvankka tuki Ukrainalle yli puoluerajojen kylmän sodan perinnöstä ja entisten sotilaitten suuresta osuudesta senaatissa, vai siitä että militääriteollisuus on Jenkkilässä supervahva ja Raytheonin sun muiden tilauskirjat pullistelevat Ukrainan sodan myötä?
Tässä vielä galluptietoa amerikkalaisen yleisön ajatuksista, etten vallan savolaislähtöistä amerikanserkkuani joudu uskomaan, elokuussa tehdyn gallupin mukaan vain 18% vastaajista vastusti aseavun lähettämistä Ukrainalle, 53% oli puolesta ja 28% EOS:
https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default...uters Ukraine Half Anniversary 08 19 2022.pdf
The big picture: Roughly 53% of Americans surveyed said they supported the U.S. backing Ukraine "until all Russian forces are withdrawn," Reuters reported.
Sitten keskusteltiin Amerikan ja amerikkalaisten tuesta Ukrainalle. Siinä on mielestäni yllättävää, että hänen mukaansa tuki Ukrainan tukemiselle kattaa laajasti molempien puolueiden poliitikot ja kannattajat äärirepublikaanisia teekutsuliikkeen edustajia lukuunottamatta. Tässäkin asiassa tennesseeläinen senaattori Marsha Blackburn osoittaa kyllä melkoista logiikka: kannattaa kyllä Ukrainan tukemista rukoilemalla, muttei aseapua.
Johtuukohan Jenkkilän kohtuuvankka tuki Ukrainalle yli puoluerajojen kylmän sodan perinnöstä ja entisten sotilaitten suuresta osuudesta senaatissa, vai siitä että militääriteollisuus on Jenkkilässä supervahva ja Raytheonin sun muiden tilauskirjat pullistelevat Ukrainan sodan myötä?
Tässä vielä galluptietoa amerikkalaisen yleisön ajatuksista, etten vallan savolaislähtöistä amerikanserkkuani joudu uskomaan, elokuussa tehdyn gallupin mukaan vain 18% vastaajista vastusti aseavun lähettämistä Ukrainalle, 53% oli puolesta ja 28% EOS:
https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default...uters Ukraine Half Anniversary 08 19 2022.pdf
The big picture: Roughly 53% of Americans surveyed said they supported the U.S. backing Ukraine "until all Russian forces are withdrawn," Reuters reported.
- Only about 18% of respondents said they opposed such a move.
- The support for the American backing of Ukraine was bipartisan, with 66% of Democrats and 51% of Republicans in favor.
- In addition, 51% of respondents favored sending arms to Ukraine, while 22% opposed it.
- Most Americans surveyed opposed sending American troops to Ukraine — with only 26% supporting — but 43% supported sending U.S. troops to NATO countries neighboring Ukraine.
- 71% jenkkiläisistä on sitä mieltä, että jos ei Ryssää pysäytetä Ukrainassa, se rohkaisee Ryssää käyttämään sotilaallisia keinoja muualla Euroopassa tai lähialueilla
Onko kelläkään tiedossa mikä kappale näissä useissa tämän tyylisissä videoissa soi taustalla?
Myös ryhmitysalueet saattavat olla rajallisia, joten ei liene mahdoton ajatus että lisäjoukkoja lastattaisiin juniin vielä siinä kohdassa kun ensimmäiset yksiköt lähtevät vyörymään vihollisen yli. Ideana siis tuoda lisää joukkoja hyökkäyksen perään sitä mukaa kun alueita saadaan vapautettua ja siivous-/sivustansuojausporukkaa tai levännyttä kärkeä tarvitaan enemmän kuin alunperin oli lähtöalueelle saatu mahtumaan.