Ei oikeastaan, tuosta puuttuukin osa lauseista jotka eivät avautuneet.
Ilmavoimien tulevaisuus
- Viestiketjun aloittaja Museo
- Aloitus PVM
-
- Tagit
- ilmavoimat tulevaisuus
Ei oikeastaan, tuosta puuttuukin osa lauseista jotka eivät avautuneet.
BarrelNut
Kenraali
Barreli ei ole nähnyt aikaisemmin? Tältä se tulee näyttämään.
Onhan näitä yllä olevan kaltaisia fanipoikien kuvatekeleitä muutenkin nähty, tuskin tuo yllä oleva brasilialaisen Eniltonin näkemys aiheesta on sen enempää virallinen kuin nämä muutkaan. En ainakaan minä linkkaisi tuollaista ja väittäisi koneen olevan tuon näköinen jos ei lähde ole virallinen.
Kyllähän näitä fanipoikien tekeleitä on netti täynnä juu:
http://www.defensenews.com/story/de...t-gen-gripen-fighter-jets-ready-may/80573874/
Saab odottaa Slovakian ostavan 8 kpl Gripen C/D:tä vaalien jälkeen.
Saab odottaa Slovakian ostavan 8 kpl Gripen C/D:tä vaalien jälkeen.
Ja tämä 70 miljoonaa oli siis LockMartille maksettu osuus. Paljollako työtä ovat tehneet Patria ja ilmavoimat samassa projektissa? Liekö edes julkaistu missään...
Ei tuohon varmaan ihan yksiselitteistä vastausta olekaan kun kaikki vaikuttaa kaikkeen. Kallista lystiä joka tapauksessa. Suorastaan hämmästyttävän kallista. Jopa kymmeniä prosentteja koko ohjushankinnan kustannuksista.
Sarek1
Ylipäällikkö
Ihanan kallista, voisi joku tuosta sanoa. Voisikohan tässä olla kyse jonkinlaisesta LypsäMisestä (tm)?
No, jonkinlainen pakko-ostos ja välttämätön paha nuo integrointipaketit kuitenkin ovat; olipa hankittu asejärjestelmä mikä ja kenen tekemä hyvänsä, se on saatava toimimaan. Kustannusten erotteleminen paketeiksi on eräs tapa hämärtää kokonaishintaa, joka on kuitenkin maksettava. Poliitikoille palastellut osasummat voivat olla helpompia nieltäviä kuin kylmä totuus.
Raveni
Greatest Leader
This third contract for Finland includes wind tunnel models and test support, software development completion, logistics support and engineering documentation. All work under this contract will be completed by third quarter 2016.
Eli tuulitunneli malli + tuki sekä ohjelmisto ja dokmentaatio
$34.2 million June 2013 contract award for test missiles, software development and engineering documentation as well as tooling, process development and equipment for facility expansion. The first contract, awarded in 2012, initiated the six-year integration, production and sustainment effort.
Testi ohjuksia, ohjelmisto kehitystä ja dokumentaatiota, työvälineitä. Prosessi kehitystä, tehdas välineitä.
Ensimmäisessä vaiheessa tuli se varsinainen integrointi hornettiin joka maksoi 5milj. taalaa. Toisin sanoen hornettiin se ohjelmisto.. Jos suomi on halunnut niin kuin tavallisesti on esim. omat testauslaitteistot sekä kaikki mahdollisest dokumetaatiot niin varmasti hintaa tulee.. Meillä ei myöskään aikaisemmin ole ollut risteilyohjuksia niin saattaa olla että sen vuoksikin hankittu kamaa mitä ei normaalisti tarvitsisi tai toiste ei tarvita... Voihan olla, että tuossa kolmannessa vaiheessa on integroitu lisäksi ER versio joka on kokonaan uusi softa
Joku toinen esim. Taurus olisi saattanut olla halvempi integroitava
Eli tuulitunneli malli + tuki sekä ohjelmisto ja dokmentaatio
$34.2 million June 2013 contract award for test missiles, software development and engineering documentation as well as tooling, process development and equipment for facility expansion. The first contract, awarded in 2012, initiated the six-year integration, production and sustainment effort.
Testi ohjuksia, ohjelmisto kehitystä ja dokumentaatiota, työvälineitä. Prosessi kehitystä, tehdas välineitä.
Ensimmäisessä vaiheessa tuli se varsinainen integrointi hornettiin joka maksoi 5milj. taalaa. Toisin sanoen hornettiin se ohjelmisto.. Jos suomi on halunnut niin kuin tavallisesti on esim. omat testauslaitteistot sekä kaikki mahdollisest dokumetaatiot niin varmasti hintaa tulee.. Meillä ei myöskään aikaisemmin ole ollut risteilyohjuksia niin saattaa olla että sen vuoksikin hankittu kamaa mitä ei normaalisti tarvitsisi tai toiste ei tarvita... Voihan olla, että tuossa kolmannessa vaiheessa on integroitu lisäksi ER versio joka on kokonaan uusi softa
Joku toinen esim. Taurus olisi saattanut olla halvempi integroitava
Raveni
Greatest Leader
Lockheed Martin Receives JASSM® Contract for Integration
Lockheed Martin [NYSE: LMT] received a $5.1 million Foreign Military Sale contract from the U.S. Air Force to support integration of the Joint Air-to-Surface Standoff Missile (JASSM) onto the Finnish Air Force (FiAF) F-18C/D aircraft.
The contract is for the first phase of a six-year effort of software development and aircraft integration support. Additional contract awards are expected for remaining phases of integration support, missile procurement and post-production support. Finland is the second international customer for JASSM, following the Commonwealth of Australia, which became the first export customer in February 2006.
“JASSM plays a critical role in giving allied warfighters the operational flexibility, reliability and effectiveness necessary to complete their missions,” said Alan Jackson, director of strike systems in Lockheed Martin’s Missiles and Fire Control business. “The team has worked hard to be able to deliver this vital and affordable capability to our allied partners.”
JASSM integration will coincide with the FiAF Mid-Life Two upgrade of their F-18 aircraft. The U.S. Navy will lead the integration effort in coordination with the U.S. Air Force, Lockheed Martin and the FiAF. Integration activities will take place at the Naval Air Warfare Center Weapons Division in China Lake, Calif.
The award aligns with the recent JASSM Production Lot 10 procurement contract to employ economies of scale, reducing cost for both the U.S. Government and Finland. JASSM on the
F-18C/D enables Finland to fulfill its regional defense role, as well as its European community and North Atlantic Treaty Organization's (NATO) Partnership for Peace responsibilities.
The contract award follows several recent JASSM program milestones, including the Lot 10 contract award, certification of JASSM on the Royal Australian Air Force F/A-18 and successful integration on the U.S. Air Force F-15E.
JASSM is an autonomous, air-to-ground, precision-guided standoff missile designed to meet the needs of U.S. and allied warfighters. Armed with a penetrator and blast fragmentation warhead, JASSM cruises autonomously, day or night in all weather conditions. The missile employs an infrared seeker and enhanced digital anti-jam Global Positioning System to find specific points on targets.
The stealthy JASSM is integrated on the U.S. Air Force’s B-1, B-2, B-52, F-16 and F-15E. Internationally, JASSM is certified on the F/A-18A/B for the Royal Australian Air Force. Future integration efforts will focus on the U.S. and international versions of the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II fighter aircraft and other international platforms.
Produced at the company’s manufacturing facility in Troy, Ala., Lockheed Martin has assembled more than 1,100 JASSMs for testing and operational use toward a total objective of 4,900 JASSM missiles.
Headquartered in Bethesda, Md., Lockheed Martin is a global security company that employs about 120,000 people worldwide and is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture, integration and sustainment of advanced technology systems, products and services. The corporation's net sales for 2011 were $46.5 billion.
Tästä voisi rivien välistä lukea, että suomi on osaltaan maksamassa aseen integrointia siksi että se ei ole edes jenkeissä ollut integroituna vielä eli koko homma on ollut sielläkin vaiheessa.
Lockheed Martin [NYSE: LMT] received a $5.1 million Foreign Military Sale contract from the U.S. Air Force to support integration of the Joint Air-to-Surface Standoff Missile (JASSM) onto the Finnish Air Force (FiAF) F-18C/D aircraft.
The contract is for the first phase of a six-year effort of software development and aircraft integration support. Additional contract awards are expected for remaining phases of integration support, missile procurement and post-production support. Finland is the second international customer for JASSM, following the Commonwealth of Australia, which became the first export customer in February 2006.
“JASSM plays a critical role in giving allied warfighters the operational flexibility, reliability and effectiveness necessary to complete their missions,” said Alan Jackson, director of strike systems in Lockheed Martin’s Missiles and Fire Control business. “The team has worked hard to be able to deliver this vital and affordable capability to our allied partners.”
JASSM integration will coincide with the FiAF Mid-Life Two upgrade of their F-18 aircraft. The U.S. Navy will lead the integration effort in coordination with the U.S. Air Force, Lockheed Martin and the FiAF. Integration activities will take place at the Naval Air Warfare Center Weapons Division in China Lake, Calif.
The award aligns with the recent JASSM Production Lot 10 procurement contract to employ economies of scale, reducing cost for both the U.S. Government and Finland. JASSM on the
F-18C/D enables Finland to fulfill its regional defense role, as well as its European community and North Atlantic Treaty Organization's (NATO) Partnership for Peace responsibilities.
The contract award follows several recent JASSM program milestones, including the Lot 10 contract award, certification of JASSM on the Royal Australian Air Force F/A-18 and successful integration on the U.S. Air Force F-15E.
JASSM is an autonomous, air-to-ground, precision-guided standoff missile designed to meet the needs of U.S. and allied warfighters. Armed with a penetrator and blast fragmentation warhead, JASSM cruises autonomously, day or night in all weather conditions. The missile employs an infrared seeker and enhanced digital anti-jam Global Positioning System to find specific points on targets.
The stealthy JASSM is integrated on the U.S. Air Force’s B-1, B-2, B-52, F-16 and F-15E. Internationally, JASSM is certified on the F/A-18A/B for the Royal Australian Air Force. Future integration efforts will focus on the U.S. and international versions of the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II fighter aircraft and other international platforms.
Produced at the company’s manufacturing facility in Troy, Ala., Lockheed Martin has assembled more than 1,100 JASSMs for testing and operational use toward a total objective of 4,900 JASSM missiles.
Headquartered in Bethesda, Md., Lockheed Martin is a global security company that employs about 120,000 people worldwide and is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture, integration and sustainment of advanced technology systems, products and services. The corporation's net sales for 2011 were $46.5 billion.
Tästä voisi rivien välistä lukea, että suomi on osaltaan maksamassa aseen integrointia siksi että se ei ole edes jenkeissä ollut integroituna vielä eli koko homma on ollut sielläkin vaiheessa.
Raveni
Greatest Leader
The offer for Poland vs JASSM for Finland
After the State Department's approval for the sale to Poland of the package of JASSM missiles has been published, some commentators confronted the estimated value of the Polish contract for 40 missiles with a similar transaction for Finland, approved by the DSCA in 2012. The maximum value cap of the contract for 70 JASSM missiles for Finland plus supplementary equipment has been set at 255 mln U.S. dollars, which is compared to the 500 mln offer in case of Poland. Lockheed Martin's representatives however are pointing out that the potential contract for Poland also includes the F-16 fighters upgrade.
The Polish JASSM package includes the software, modifications and testing of the F-16's, verification and certification as well as - of course - the missiles themselves. It was different in case of Finland, because Lockheed Martin has sold only the JASSM missiles.
told Defence24.pl Joseph Breen, Business Development Director at Missile and Fire Control department of Lockheed Martin company
They also indicate that the F/A-18 Hornet aircraft, on which the Finns are integrating the JASSM missiles, are manufactured by Boeing company, so Lockheed Martin is only supplying the missiles and their maintenance. The Finnish government along with the U.S. Navy, the American administration and the Boeing company is implementing a testing program and adjusting their fighters for carrying new missiles under a separate contract. In Lockheed Martin's view it isn't fair to compare the figures from the FMS documents for Poland and Finland because of the differences in the scale of the potential contract, as the Polish Air Force is to receive within the contract a modernization package for the F-16 C/D fighters.
http://www.defence24.com/150413,jassm-for-poland-is-it-worth-to-pay-the-price
Tuossa mielenkiintoinen vertailu...
After the State Department's approval for the sale to Poland of the package of JASSM missiles has been published, some commentators confronted the estimated value of the Polish contract for 40 missiles with a similar transaction for Finland, approved by the DSCA in 2012. The maximum value cap of the contract for 70 JASSM missiles for Finland plus supplementary equipment has been set at 255 mln U.S. dollars, which is compared to the 500 mln offer in case of Poland. Lockheed Martin's representatives however are pointing out that the potential contract for Poland also includes the F-16 fighters upgrade.
The Polish JASSM package includes the software, modifications and testing of the F-16's, verification and certification as well as - of course - the missiles themselves. It was different in case of Finland, because Lockheed Martin has sold only the JASSM missiles.
told Defence24.pl Joseph Breen, Business Development Director at Missile and Fire Control department of Lockheed Martin company
They also indicate that the F/A-18 Hornet aircraft, on which the Finns are integrating the JASSM missiles, are manufactured by Boeing company, so Lockheed Martin is only supplying the missiles and their maintenance. The Finnish government along with the U.S. Navy, the American administration and the Boeing company is implementing a testing program and adjusting their fighters for carrying new missiles under a separate contract. In Lockheed Martin's view it isn't fair to compare the figures from the FMS documents for Poland and Finland because of the differences in the scale of the potential contract, as the Polish Air Force is to receive within the contract a modernization package for the F-16 C/D fighters.
http://www.defence24.com/150413,jassm-for-poland-is-it-worth-to-pay-the-price
Tuossa mielenkiintoinen vertailu...
Ai K-77M on siis infrapunaohjus ja AESA relevanttia IP-ohjustekniikkaa? Noh aina sitä oppii uutta...
Näille ja sitä edeltäville viesteillesi ovat leimallisia
- Fanipoika-sanan jatkuva toistelu
- Valikoiva lukeminen / luetun ymmärtäminen
- Substanssin puute
Tiedän, että pystyt halutessasi laadukkaampaankin ulosantiin. Joten toivottavasti pyrit siihen.
[
Olet oikeassa. Tietoni perustui erääseen italialaiseen sivustoon jossa oli tämä virheellinen tieto. Olisi pitänyt tarkistaa valmistajan sivulta.
Olet oikeassa. Tietoni perustui erääseen italialaiseen sivustoon jossa oli tämä virheellinen tieto. Olisi pitänyt tarkistaa valmistajan sivulta.
JASSM hankintasopimukset (hankkeen kesto 6 vuotta)
01.03.2012 (PV-USAF)
-178,5 milj € JASSM ohjusten hankinta. (Puolustusministeriön valtuutus)
03.12.2012
-5,1 milj $ integraatioon
31.05.2013
-34,2 milj $ testaus
14.06.2013
-9,9 milj $ JASSM Unique Planning Component (UPC) tehtävänsuunnittelusofta. Summa jakautuu Suomen ja Australian välille.
Edit: Piti kirjoittaman että 178,5 milj € voi olla koko hankintasumma, johon tuo integraatiokin sisältyy. Voi siis olla että PV on tehnyt yhden hankintasopimuksen USAF (FMS) kanssa ja USAF sitten edelleen tekee hankkeen edetessä alkuperäisen hankintasopimuksen mukaisia tilauksia toimittajilta.
01.03.2012 (PV-USAF)
-178,5 milj € JASSM ohjusten hankinta. (Puolustusministeriön valtuutus)
03.12.2012
-5,1 milj $ integraatioon
31.05.2013
-34,2 milj $ testaus
14.06.2013
-9,9 milj $ JASSM Unique Planning Component (UPC) tehtävänsuunnittelusofta. Summa jakautuu Suomen ja Australian välille.
Edit: Piti kirjoittaman että 178,5 milj € voi olla koko hankintasumma, johon tuo integraatiokin sisältyy. Voi siis olla että PV on tehnyt yhden hankintasopimuksen USAF (FMS) kanssa ja USAF sitten edelleen tekee hankkeen edetessä alkuperäisen hankintasopimuksen mukaisia tilauksia toimittajilta.
Viimeksi muokattu:
http://www.defensenews.com/story/de...e-saabs-gripen-ng-fighter-jet-india/80566588/
"In Europe, Saab has identified Finland’s and Belgium’s fighter replacement programs as those offering the highest potential in terms of success."
"In Europe, Saab has identified Finland’s and Belgium’s fighter replacement programs as those offering the highest potential in terms of success."
KymJP1/96
Kapteeni
Jos tässä ja nyt alettaisiin tilausta vääntämään, niin itse näkisin kyseeseen tulevan 2 eri konetyyppiä. 40 kappaletta F-18EF tai vastaava määrä F-16 E_FIN. Sitten 15-20 kappaletta F-35. Super Hornettiin kun saisi sitten ympättyä tuon Growlerin mukaan tavalla tai toisella. Typhoonin ja Rafaelin minä kyllä unohtaisin nyt ja tulevaisuudessa, ellei hinta tule olennaisesti alaspäin. Nuo koneet kun eivät anna mitään superseksikästä verrattuna F16/18 akselille ottaen hintaeron huomioon.
Gripen NG on kyllä tulevaisuudessa varteenotettava vaihtoehto. Suurin syy Ruotsin läheisyys ja toivon mukaan hinta. Svenssonien kanssa lienee mahdollista tehdä vaikka minkälaista kauppaa hyvillä ehdoilla ja jos sitten tarvetta tulee, niin sieltä voi saada uutta tai vanhaa Gripeniä lisää. F-35 tietenkin paras vaihtoehto... Tai ainakin modernein, mutta onhan tuossa aika paljon kysymysmerkkejä. Onko se stealth 15-vuoden päästä enää stealth? Mitä käyttö maksaa? Onko ne suoritusarvot kunnossa jne jne. Ja hinta ainakin vielä taivaissa.
Gripen NG on kyllä tulevaisuudessa varteenotettava vaihtoehto. Suurin syy Ruotsin läheisyys ja toivon mukaan hinta. Svenssonien kanssa lienee mahdollista tehdä vaikka minkälaista kauppaa hyvillä ehdoilla ja jos sitten tarvetta tulee, niin sieltä voi saada uutta tai vanhaa Gripeniä lisää. F-35 tietenkin paras vaihtoehto... Tai ainakin modernein, mutta onhan tuossa aika paljon kysymysmerkkejä. Onko se stealth 15-vuoden päästä enää stealth? Mitä käyttö maksaa? Onko ne suoritusarvot kunnossa jne jne. Ja hinta ainakin vielä taivaissa.
Suomi kyllä, mutta Belgiaa pidän epätodennäköisenä Norjan tapauksen perusteella.
Wikipediasta:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saab_JAS_39_Gripen
"In December 2010leaked United States diplomatic cables revealed that the United States deliberately delayed Sweden's request for access to a US AESA radar until after Norway's selection. The cables also indicated that Norwegian consideration of the Gripen "was just a show" and that Norway had decided to purchase the F-35 due to "high-level political pressure" from the US.[41]"
Vielä vähän lisätietoa Meteor/AESA kehitykseen liittyen täällä:
http://aviationweek.com/awin-only/japan-britain-collaborate-meteor-guidance
"Mitsubishi Electric AAM-4B air-to-air missile (AESA), which entered production in 2010 to equip Japanese Boeing F-15s and Mitsubishi Heavy Industries’s F-2s."
Eli japanilaisilla on ollut A2A ohjus jossa on AESA-tutka jo n. 6 vuotta.
Amerikkalaiset ovat pistäneet AMRAAMin jatkokehityksen jäihin:
http://gripen4canada.blogspot.fi/2014/08/meteor-vs-amraam-minor-upgrade-or.html
Meteor vs. AMRAAM: Minor upgrade or paradigm shift?
"Further improvements to the AMRAAM, including possible ramjet propulsion have been put on hold"
Viimeksi muokattu:
Aiemmin mainitsemani Slovakian kauppa on ilmeisesti Saabin kannalta niin selvää pässin lihaa, että kokoonpano on jo aloitettu, ennen allekirjoitusta.
http://aviationweek.com/awindefense/slovakia-s-gripens-fabrication-ahead-contract
Kyseessä siis kahdeksan uuden C/D koneen kauppa.
http://aviationweek.com/awindefense/slovakia-s-gripens-fabrication-ahead-contract
Kyseessä siis kahdeksan uuden C/D koneen kauppa.
Tässä ajankohtaista pohdiskelua. Käsitelty mm. täällä pinnalla olleita teemoja. Ihan jokaisesta asiasta en ole välttämättä samaa mieltä, mutta herättelevää luettavaa.
http://aviationweek.com/defense/new-world-ordnance-singapore-airshow
To understand the future of air-to-air warfare in Asia, take a careful look at the flying and static displays here. The Malaysian air force’s Su-30MKM is putting on a show that reminds you that the jet was impressive before the astonishing Su-35S – coming to local theaters soon – joined the show circuit. The Rafale is back. On the ground, Singapore’s F-15SG and F-16D are familiar, but some of their features bear a second look.
It’s been a while since anyone claimed in public that the Lockheed Martin F-35 Joint Strike Fighter would have a 6:1 air combat advantage over any not-as-stealthy competitor. I don’t know whether the U.S. Air Force ever believed this, but if they still did, they would not be spending billions on upgrades to their 30-to-35-year-old F-15Cs.
It will be some time, in any scenario, before stealthy aircraft are a big part of the Asia-Pacific fighter inventory, but the Sukhoi family also forces adversaries to look at two other aspects of fighter capability: electronic warfare and weapons.
In October 2012, the supercarrier USS George Washington paid a visit to Malaysia that included a photo-op formation of Super Hornets and Su-30MKMs. Hanging on the wingtips of the Sukhois were fat cylindrical pods – Russian-made KNIRTI SAP-518 active jamming systems. The SAP-518 is not only big and powerful but uses state-of-the-art digital radio-frequency memory (DRFM) technology. Maybe it can beat an attack by an AIM-120C advanced medium air-to-air missile (Amraam) and maybe it can’t, but . . . Do you feel lucky today?
The proliferation of DRFM jamming – the Russians design the DRFM chips but have them made in foreign foundries, which are where you’d expect them to be – triggered renewed U.S. attention to EW self-protection systems after decades of neglect: aside from the Super Hornet’s ALQ-214, the Pentagon hadn’t sponsored a new active jamming system for a fighter since the 1980s.
Israel, Singapore and others had seen that gap earlier, which is why the various warts and excrescences on the Singapore air force fighters here bear examination. The F-16D has a self-protection suite by Elbit’s Elisra subsidiary. The F-15SG’s digital electronic warfare system is also reportedly from Israel.
The F-15SG has a more jamming-resistant active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar and, if the adversary’s EW is still a problem, an infrared search and track (IRST) system. The U.S. Air Force is now funding AESAs, IRST and new EW for its F-15s. The Rafale’s presence is a reminder, too, that Dassault, Saab and the Typhoon partners addressed the EW issue from the outset.
The Sukhoi fighters’ agility challenges weapon design. That the jet is a difficult target for Amraam is beyond serious dispute: the range at which Amraam has a high kill probability declines sharply as targets become more evasive. It was why the MBDA Meteor was developed in the first place.
All the Euro-canards are getting Meteor (it will be fully operational this year on Gripen). Other recent AAM disclosures and program starts include Rafael’s I-Derby Extended Range – which, among other things, buries Derby’s low-key reputation as an Amraam substitute – and the new-build version of the MBDA Advanced Short-Range AAM. The new Asraam takes a leaf out of Rafael’s strategy book by using commonality with land- and sea-launched missiles to reduce cost.
The U.S. AAM program, by contrast, seems disorganized. The fundamental limitation on Amraam is motor size, because the weapon was designed to fit the F-16’s wingtip mounts. The same applies to the AIM-9X, designed around old Sidewinder motors – the fatter Asraam has 70% more volume per unit length. Management is split between the air force (Amraam) and the navy (AIM-9X), with some work being done by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency, and it seems likely that a further complication is the presence of black programs.
The result is that projects like the longer-range AIM-9X Block III and Joint Dual Role Air Dominance Missile have come and gone, and minimally funded studies proliferate (Raytheon got $14 million in January for two self-defense-missile concepts), but nothing beyond the AIM-120D is in sight. Black-world miracle missiles will not be available to allies, and neither will foreign missiles on U.S. aircraft: it literally took an act of Congress to get money in the 2017 budget to test the MBDA Brimstone on the Super Hornet.
F-16 operators may elect to live with these limitations as they upgrade their aircraft, but in the mid-term, EW and weapon considerations could work to the benefit of the European fighters, with sensor fusion, IRST, built-in EW and a wider choice of weapons.
http://aviationweek.com/defense/new-world-ordnance-singapore-airshow
To understand the future of air-to-air warfare in Asia, take a careful look at the flying and static displays here. The Malaysian air force’s Su-30MKM is putting on a show that reminds you that the jet was impressive before the astonishing Su-35S – coming to local theaters soon – joined the show circuit. The Rafale is back. On the ground, Singapore’s F-15SG and F-16D are familiar, but some of their features bear a second look.
It’s been a while since anyone claimed in public that the Lockheed Martin F-35 Joint Strike Fighter would have a 6:1 air combat advantage over any not-as-stealthy competitor. I don’t know whether the U.S. Air Force ever believed this, but if they still did, they would not be spending billions on upgrades to their 30-to-35-year-old F-15Cs.
It will be some time, in any scenario, before stealthy aircraft are a big part of the Asia-Pacific fighter inventory, but the Sukhoi family also forces adversaries to look at two other aspects of fighter capability: electronic warfare and weapons.
In October 2012, the supercarrier USS George Washington paid a visit to Malaysia that included a photo-op formation of Super Hornets and Su-30MKMs. Hanging on the wingtips of the Sukhois were fat cylindrical pods – Russian-made KNIRTI SAP-518 active jamming systems. The SAP-518 is not only big and powerful but uses state-of-the-art digital radio-frequency memory (DRFM) technology. Maybe it can beat an attack by an AIM-120C advanced medium air-to-air missile (Amraam) and maybe it can’t, but . . . Do you feel lucky today?
The proliferation of DRFM jamming – the Russians design the DRFM chips but have them made in foreign foundries, which are where you’d expect them to be – triggered renewed U.S. attention to EW self-protection systems after decades of neglect: aside from the Super Hornet’s ALQ-214, the Pentagon hadn’t sponsored a new active jamming system for a fighter since the 1980s.
Israel, Singapore and others had seen that gap earlier, which is why the various warts and excrescences on the Singapore air force fighters here bear examination. The F-16D has a self-protection suite by Elbit’s Elisra subsidiary. The F-15SG’s digital electronic warfare system is also reportedly from Israel.
The F-15SG has a more jamming-resistant active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar and, if the adversary’s EW is still a problem, an infrared search and track (IRST) system. The U.S. Air Force is now funding AESAs, IRST and new EW for its F-15s. The Rafale’s presence is a reminder, too, that Dassault, Saab and the Typhoon partners addressed the EW issue from the outset.
The Sukhoi fighters’ agility challenges weapon design. That the jet is a difficult target for Amraam is beyond serious dispute: the range at which Amraam has a high kill probability declines sharply as targets become more evasive. It was why the MBDA Meteor was developed in the first place.
All the Euro-canards are getting Meteor (it will be fully operational this year on Gripen). Other recent AAM disclosures and program starts include Rafael’s I-Derby Extended Range – which, among other things, buries Derby’s low-key reputation as an Amraam substitute – and the new-build version of the MBDA Advanced Short-Range AAM. The new Asraam takes a leaf out of Rafael’s strategy book by using commonality with land- and sea-launched missiles to reduce cost.
The U.S. AAM program, by contrast, seems disorganized. The fundamental limitation on Amraam is motor size, because the weapon was designed to fit the F-16’s wingtip mounts. The same applies to the AIM-9X, designed around old Sidewinder motors – the fatter Asraam has 70% more volume per unit length. Management is split between the air force (Amraam) and the navy (AIM-9X), with some work being done by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency, and it seems likely that a further complication is the presence of black programs.
The result is that projects like the longer-range AIM-9X Block III and Joint Dual Role Air Dominance Missile have come and gone, and minimally funded studies proliferate (Raytheon got $14 million in January for two self-defense-missile concepts), but nothing beyond the AIM-120D is in sight. Black-world miracle missiles will not be available to allies, and neither will foreign missiles on U.S. aircraft: it literally took an act of Congress to get money in the 2017 budget to test the MBDA Brimstone on the Super Hornet.
F-16 operators may elect to live with these limitations as they upgrade their aircraft, but in the mid-term, EW and weapon considerations could work to the benefit of the European fighters, with sensor fusion, IRST, built-in EW and a wider choice of weapons.
Slammer
Kenraali
Ei. Kuviossa pitäisi valita konetyypit niin, että niiden ominaisuudet tukevat toisiaan mahdollisimman hyvin ja esim. asejärjestelmien yhteensopivuus olisi etu.
Huhta
Greatest Leader
@KymJP1/96 Hienoa nähdä vanhempien ja vähemmän kirjoittavienkin jäsenten osallistuvan debattiin. Tervetuloa mukaan!
Kahden konetyypin ratkaisu, niin hienolta kuin se paperilla voi näyttääkin, on valitettavasti monien hylkimä vaihtoehto. Ja onhan siihen perustellut syytkin: Suomen mittakaavaa edustavien konemäärien kohdalla huolto- ja koulutusjärjestelmien luominen tulee suhteellisen kalliiksi, ja on vaikea nähdä, että kahden konetyypin tuomat edut oikeuttaisivat kahden eri konetyypin olemassaolon organisaatiossa.
Kahden konetyypin ratkaisu, niin hienolta kuin se paperilla voi näyttääkin, on valitettavasti monien hylkimä vaihtoehto. Ja onhan siihen perustellut syytkin: Suomen mittakaavaa edustavien konemäärien kohdalla huolto- ja koulutusjärjestelmien luominen tulee suhteellisen kalliiksi, ja on vaikea nähdä, että kahden konetyypin tuomat edut oikeuttaisivat kahden eri konetyypin olemassaolon organisaatiossa.